Atheist vs. Believer
An Ordinary Debate
Such debate is very much universal starting since the creation of Human Race and will prevail until the day of Qyamat.
An Ordinary Debate
Such debate is very much universal starting since the creation of Human Race and will prevail until the day of Qyamat.
Dear Editor,
I have really been very much excited getting the most attractive offer from you. I have been waiting eagerly for such kind of offer for long. It’s a great opportunity for me and I am feeling highly privileged. I am preparing myself for writing in my dearest dailies, Jajadi.
This is for your kind information that after my last debate with Mr. Avijit that I sent to you I sent a mail to him titled “Faith…” and in reply he sent me his writing in Bangla titled “Alo Hote Chaliache Adharer Jatri – 7” (The universe and the God – a philosophic discussion). I downloaded that writing and sent a reply to Mr. Avijit titled “Reason behind the Reason”.
I am sending herewith that debate for your kind information and necessary steps, if possible.
Regards,
Noore Alam Siddiqui
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi,
f@ith…
This writing is not an effort to convert a disbeliever to a believer or to make belief stronger of a believer.
This is just a statement – why I believe.
Believing invisibility is the precondition of faith. As the wise and intelligent creature human being has to have faith not by seeing directly, but by considering circumstances and reason. Keeping faith in invisibility is applicable to animal. If we show a cow grass, it must come before you. Therefore, being an intelligent creature why should we bring us to the level of an animal.
In this 21st Century human being has made a stunning advancement in all the branches of knowledge. So, why this intelligence can not find any reason or evidence to keep faith in invisibility. But reality is that in this world we keep faith in various matters which we have not seen and there is no possibility of getting chance to see in our life time.
This world is completely based on faith. We have not seen all the matters/facts what we believe. In almost all the mater we relay on guess and probability. We guess that it might be happened or may have happened as it is being happened so far. By watching the foot prints of a particular animal we come into conclusion that the particular animal have walked past this place. Similarly, a man identifies his father simply by the verbal consent of his mother, resemblance of appearance & behavior and over confidence on the character of his mother without DNA Test. We also believe that something, some people, some places, some objects exist without watching them practically.
Our knowledge is very much limited. In this regard we can remember the comment of Isaac Newton about his realization of his limitation of knowledge. Hundreds of matter that were the subject matter of Science fiction have come into reality in this 21st century. We did not know about the atom, its structure and its huge power before the invention of microscope. Physically we have also various limitations. Our auditory capability is 20 to 20000 hrtz and we can not hear the sound less than 20 hrtz and more than 20000 hrtz, there might have been various sounds, speeches around us that we can not hear, but the animal having sixth sense can realize that sound. Similarly, the electromagnetic wave/signal is carrying thousands of information, pictures around us, but we can not see and hear them without the receiver. So, there might have been thousands of various other facts happening around us that we can not see, hear and realize.
Hundreds of thousands of Prophets have been sent with the verses of God in this world who were the most perfect men in this world in all respect, who never told a lie in their whole life. So why can not rely on their message, whereas we rely on the ordinary people in our daily life? We should thing profoundly on the order of the Nature – the shining and setting of the Sun, falling of sweet but not salty water of rain, growing up of living things, Eco System of this world, inter dependence of the animal, proper distance of the Sun and the Moon from our earth, proper proportion of different gases in the atmosphere, tide in the river and in the sea, proportion of water and solid matter in the human body and on the earth and thousands of other events that has been occurred around us every day where a very little exception/disorder of all those events might bring disastrous consequences.
Roger Bacon says- if a man can not believe in God by watching very much ordinary thing such as, falling of rain and growing up of plants on the land, God will not come before that man to make him believe in God.
This universe has been created with the Big Bang. There must have been a plan before that Big Bang. Without proper pre-plan nothing can be created just with a big explosion. If so, we might have seen that a small plane or bus had been created with the crash of an airplane or with the explosion of an atom bomb it might have been created various objects. Similarly, if we put ink, paper and many other things in a printing press needed for making a complete book and then blow it up with a powerful bomb, there is no possibility to get a well-bind and well-printed book. But, the reality is that for getting a complete book in hand we will have to go through some logical process, such as, manuscript, computer compose, proof reading, correction, arranging paper, ink, printing press and many other necessary things.
Similarly, the whole Universe where billions of galaxies, Solar Systems, Stars, Planets and Satellites spreading over billions of Light Years orbiting on their axis in this gradual expanding Universe with the invisible power of gravitation in very much sharp and sensitive system. There must have been someone who is behind that sensitive and critical system. Apparently, our brain might not accept this whole truth logically; therefore, God has sent thousands of prophets as his representative in this world with the Holy Book in different ages in different regions of this world so that people can realize the existence of God perfectly.
As a scholar person you must fond of reading books of various kinds. Therefore, I am earnestly requesting you to read only the Part-II (in a single book) of a book, if you have not read that book yet, named – “Bishwa Nabi” written by Kabi Golam Mustafa where the writer has discussed on various aspects of Science, faith, religion etc. I am sure; you must find interest on those topics.
Noore Alam Siddiqui
Please find
-----Original Message-----From: Avijit Roy [mailto:charbak_bd@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 3:23 AMTo: Nur - E- Alam SiddiquiSubject: Re: Faith
Thanks.
I have read yours. As a mutual respect, I hope that you would also read mine :
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/alo_hate/jaatree7.pdf
you need a acrobat reader to read.
regds
Avijit
My reply-
Reason behind the Reason
Your writing is so argumentative and informative. I thought that you were a complete disbeliever, but after reading your discussion on the issue it is being seemed to me that you are a semi believer. Sometimes your argument goes nearer to the belief of existence of God and at that very moment you come back to your previous decision that it is unprogressive, ignorance, fundamentalistic to believe in existence of God. You are so confident about the charm and glamour of being disbeliever. But the most interesting is that in many places of your writing you have given answer to this question- ‘Why we should believe in God?’
Disbelief comes from ignorance, frustration, overconfidence on thyself and over enthusiasm on a single subject. Religion does not permit anyone to do whatever he likes and consequently some people try to become disbeliever to break all kinds of moral/ethical values.
Belief is simply a realization. The existence of God can not be proved in the laboratory. It’s a process of gradual development. Materialistic attitude can not make anyone believer. We should give more emphasis on abstract thing. Love, hatred, kindness, wish, curse and so on rather than being a complete materialistic. As a rational being we should try to look for the abstract reason first behind any incident rather than materialistic reason. For example, if any one is asked why the Berlin Wall was not broken for a long time? Form a materialistic point of view the answer might be that – no people did not came with hammer, bulldozer to break it, but the reason behind the reason is that the Cold War was then ended; the balance of power was broken with the collapse of Soviet Union and so on. Similarly, the reason of crying of an injured man may be defined in two ways- from the materialistic point of view it might be that – a strong stick was put on his back and was kicked and beaten by some people, but the reality is that poverty or lack of moral values persuades him to stole something, but he has been caught red handed and is being beaten by the public. Both materialistic and abstract reasons are true, but we should find or realize the core reason behind the reason, and that should be the real wisdom. Similar cause might hide behind rainfall and the blueness of the sky, though present explanation is true. The laws of physics might be the apparent reason behind any event of this universe. Science always deals with this apparent reason and therefore, they can not give any constant theory.
There are various things which can not be formulized with the laws of physics. For example, we get various natural punishments, such as, if anyone become disobedient to his parents, if he become very rude to them, he will never get respect from his children also as we are seeing in our society. No materialistic formula, mechanism can be able to save him from getting natural punishment. But, only if he gets pardon from his parents and promises not to do such misdeed again, only then he could escape of natural punishment. Similar formula is applicable to the oppressor, autocrat, murderer and all other sinners. All those can not be defined through the laws of physics.
Indirectly, you confessed the existence of God in your writing. First, you said that if there had been any God, that might be the lifeless laws of physics. Secondly, you said that if this universe was created by God, that should be lawful, systematic and purposeful. I think, through your above comments you have confessed that any creation which is systematic, lawful and purposeful, God is behind that creation. Therefore, now it is high time to realize whether the lifeless laws of physics should be God or not and whether the creation and the laws of creation was lawful, systematic, purposeful or not. It should be realized yourself.
Scientists say that this world has been created through purposeless, lawless and chaotic situation. I should say how the scientists have been sure about that? What are the criteria of lawfulness? If we contemplate deeply, we must confess that no creation has been created purposelessly. Every creation is interdependent on each other. For upholding the eco-system and balance of environment even a very small creation, such as, and an has a great contribution to the environment. Is there any lawlessness in the nature? No scientist will be able to find any lawlessness in the nature/universe. Apparently the process of the creation of this universe might seem chaotic, but the way to lawful, purposeful and systematic universe and this is what we are seeing now.
One might think a driver of a car is very much powerful, because he can bring the car anywhere he likes, but when the car stops before a red signal, the light might seem more powerful than the previous. When a traffic police stops a car in spite of green signal, he might seem more powerful than the previous. When the owner of the car keeps it in the garage, he might seem most powerful. The observation of scientists on this universe is similar to that. They can never reach a decision on any issue.
How you have been sure that science one day will reveal the ultimate truth whereas the science is changing its decision time to time. I am also confident that science will prove the existence of God (though it has already been proved the existence of God). The existence of God is a question of ‘To Be or Not To Be’ and ‘Do or Die’. The whole truth is hiding behind our speculation. Some of us try to get answer to this question from Science and some have got answer to this question from Prophets, the representative of God. In this debate I am in a favorable position, because I follow the message of the prophets who were telling the same form the very beginning. But you follow the scientists whose ideas are based on speculation and can not reach a decision most of the time.
You are so so so much enthusiastic about science. You are severely biased with the charm of science. This is one kind of fundamentalism. But what is the real appearance and behavior of your dearest science? It has given us only the materialistic advancement. It changes its color shamelessly. It says one thing today and another tomorrow. Similarly, science once thought that all the events of this universe are controlled by the “law of causation” and “uniformity of nature” and in the root of nature there exists principle of determinacy. So this universe is like a machine and there is no necessity and possibility of existence of God. But after the discovery of cosmic radiation their ideas have been completely changed. Now they are going to Dematerialization to Materialization. Sometimes science is like those blinds who described the elephant with their own experience. So, how can we relay on science completely especially on the theoretical physics? How can we take its all theory constant and whole truth? It seemed to me by reading your discussion that the only goal of science is to prove inexistence of God by any means and the only way to be progressive, free-thinker is to support the inexistence of God. But the reality is that there are many scientists who have strong believe in God. So whom we should support in this respect?
In your writing you said many times that there are still many unanswered questions before the science. In this situation I think believing in ‘God in Gaps’ is as ignorance as not believing in the existence of God. Now you can ask me how I have been sure that God does exist. Similarly, we can also ask a disbeliever how he has been sure about the inexistence of God.
God has sent thousands of representatives in this world selecting from the whole mankind. They were given special supernatural power. They were the owner of spotless character. They have never committed any sin in their life. The First Messenger was Adam and the last was Mohammad. Four of them were sent with the Holy Book- they were Mosses with the Taurat, David with the Jabur, Jesus Christ with the Injil (Bible) and Mohammad with the Koran. From Adam to Mohammad- all of them represent the same God, conveyed the same message. That message was the existence of God, the superiority of God. Adam, Noah (Nuhu), Isaac (Ishhaq), David (Daud), Solomon (Solaiman), Abraham (Ibrahim), Mosses (Musa), Josef (Yousuf), Jesus Christ (Isha) and many more conveyed the same message and the name of that message is ISLAM. But mankind has been divided into many religions changing the message of God according to their own interpretation disobeying the command of God. No religion except ISLAM (though ISLAM is not a typical religion, it is a complete code of life) can make a believer. If you study ISLAM, Koran, Sayings and life of Mohammad and his more than 1,00,000 contemporary followers who became the all time best people of this world from the most barbarian condition. How they became the ruler of half of the world within a shortest period of time from simply a shepherd. If you study their reign up to 13th century, their social & political history, their business, their transactions and many more then you might become a believer unconsciously.
I think in spite of being a believer one can be a free-thinker, progressive, open-minded. But, unfortunately some people think that to be progressive, free-thinker, open-minded one has to be a disbeliever. If we look back to the Golden Age of Islam, we will find that there were hundreds of scientists who were advanced and devoted to scientific invention as well as to their spiritual development. Such idea was developed during the Renaissance period and reached at its pick during Victorian Era through the publication of “The Origin of Species” by Charles Darwin. In that period faith encountered the most critical situation ever in the history. But the believer did successfully overcome that situation through the revival of abstract thinking and the discovery of some scientific theories during the early 20th century. This process of development is still going on.
Not to stop questioning is the heart of science, therefore, the question-“Who created you?” can not be meaningless to science and science should try to find out the answer to this question.
Of course you have deep thirst for knowledge, but you are deeply inclined with science rather than history. All of us should learn from history. Simultaneously I would request you to study the real ISLAM, its beauty and its early social, political, cultural history. I would also request you to read some books, such as, ‘Bishwa Nabi’ by Golam Mostafa, ‘Bible, Koran and the Science’ ‘The Origin of Man’ by Dr. Morish Bukaily, ‘The Historical Role of Islam’ by M.N. Roy and many more.
Take care,
Noore Alam Siddiqui
You said Sex Education means education for making safer sex. In traditional sense, Yes. However I do not want to restrict such education in such "narrow domain". Here is an important link you may want to check, which may clarify what actually I was referring :
http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/pa/pa_sexed_hhg.htm
Please let me know whether our children get such education and also let me know whether such education is useless at all.
"America is a free-sex country and there is a proper Sex Education, but thousands of women are rapped there each year. ..So, there should be a single Code of Conduct to make our society peaceful."
Response: Before making any conclusion, we need to know why sex harassments occur in the first place. Male chauvinistic ego, sexual superiority complex, thinking women as commodity, frustration among young generation, mental sickness and disorder, law and order situation and many other things are involved. Not all the things can be handled by proper sex education, however some can.
True, there are incidents on child molestation, rape case etc in US, however normally people do not get afraid to report against those crimes. "Raper kotha janle meyer aar biye hobe na" - such situation never arises in such countries compared to ours. Each and every country has its own problem. America is a capitalist country. Many scholars think rape molestation etc are an integral part of the capitalist system where Profits over people, viewing women just as commodities, aggression rather than compassion, and establishing control are the main tenets of the system. Of course capitalist society has some advantages which freedom loving US people enjoys; however, compared to socialist countries, women oppression, rape, molestation etc are high due to the very reason they created for themselves. The issue needs a socio-political explanation which will take time and space. we can discuss this some other time.
Statistics of rape in one particular country does not invalidate the necessity of sex-education either. I have seen one statistics where it claimed that most of the road accidents occurs due to some other reason, not due to driver's alertness or abiding rules. But does this simple statistics nullify the necessity of being alert and abiding rules while driving? Perhaps not.
Now two questions for you regarding "single code of conduct" and dress:
1) In the Victorian Era, English ladies hardly showed their flesh to strangers. They even wore gloves to hid their fingers from their view. Today, English ladies use much less fabrics than men to cover their bodies. Does this mean that the English ladies have become indecent these days? Are English men taking advantage of them? What about those women we see on beaches and around swimming pools in bikinis? Do they get harassed or raped for what they wear?
2) In the African continents, there are tribes whose women do not cover the upper part of their bodies. In the jungle of Amazon, there live some tribes whose women do not wear any cloth. Despite moving around with their tops uncovered or without any cloth on their bodies, their men do not rape their half dressed or fully naked women. This is due to the reason that "decency" carries a different meaning for those so-called "uncivilized" people. Interestingly those tribal girls use to get afraid to come our "civilized" world for being afraid of molestation. Would you kindly explain what restricts the tribal guys to molest their half-naked ladies, where you civilized guys cannot do?
Avijit
Nur - E- Alam Siddiqui wrote:
Hi,
According to you, where there is a proper Sex Education, dress is insignificant there.
Perhaps you have got the most perfect Sex Education then why don’t you keep yourself undressed publicly? Why do you make sex with your in the secret place? Why you can’t watch pornographic film with your parents/children/sister? Why you don’t talk about sex with your parents/children/sister as you talk with your close friend circle?
Sex Education means education for making safer sex. There is no need to learn Sexual Morality by Sex Education. It is learned naturally and spontaneously. In the free-sex countries or sexually liberal countries dress will naturally be insignificant. America is a free-sex country and there is a proper Sex Education, but thousands of women are rapped there each year.
So, there should be a single Code of Conduct to make our society peaceful.
Take care,
Noore Alam
I have really been very much excited getting the most attractive offer from you. I have been waiting eagerly for such kind of offer for long. It’s a great opportunity for me and I am feeling highly privileged. I am preparing myself for writing in my dearest dailies, Jajadi.
This is for your kind information that after my last debate with Mr. Avijit that I sent to you I sent a mail to him titled “Faith…” and in reply he sent me his writing in Bangla titled “Alo Hote Chaliache Adharer Jatri – 7” (The universe and the God – a philosophic discussion). I downloaded that writing and sent a reply to Mr. Avijit titled “Reason behind the Reason”.
I am sending herewith that debate for your kind information and necessary steps, if possible.
Regards,
Noore Alam Siddiqui
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi,
f@ith…
This writing is not an effort to convert a disbeliever to a believer or to make belief stronger of a believer.
This is just a statement – why I believe.
Believing invisibility is the precondition of faith. As the wise and intelligent creature human being has to have faith not by seeing directly, but by considering circumstances and reason. Keeping faith in invisibility is applicable to animal. If we show a cow grass, it must come before you. Therefore, being an intelligent creature why should we bring us to the level of an animal.
In this 21st Century human being has made a stunning advancement in all the branches of knowledge. So, why this intelligence can not find any reason or evidence to keep faith in invisibility. But reality is that in this world we keep faith in various matters which we have not seen and there is no possibility of getting chance to see in our life time.
This world is completely based on faith. We have not seen all the matters/facts what we believe. In almost all the mater we relay on guess and probability. We guess that it might be happened or may have happened as it is being happened so far. By watching the foot prints of a particular animal we come into conclusion that the particular animal have walked past this place. Similarly, a man identifies his father simply by the verbal consent of his mother, resemblance of appearance & behavior and over confidence on the character of his mother without DNA Test. We also believe that something, some people, some places, some objects exist without watching them practically.
Our knowledge is very much limited. In this regard we can remember the comment of Isaac Newton about his realization of his limitation of knowledge. Hundreds of matter that were the subject matter of Science fiction have come into reality in this 21st century. We did not know about the atom, its structure and its huge power before the invention of microscope. Physically we have also various limitations. Our auditory capability is 20 to 20000 hrtz and we can not hear the sound less than 20 hrtz and more than 20000 hrtz, there might have been various sounds, speeches around us that we can not hear, but the animal having sixth sense can realize that sound. Similarly, the electromagnetic wave/signal is carrying thousands of information, pictures around us, but we can not see and hear them without the receiver. So, there might have been thousands of various other facts happening around us that we can not see, hear and realize.
Hundreds of thousands of Prophets have been sent with the verses of God in this world who were the most perfect men in this world in all respect, who never told a lie in their whole life. So why can not rely on their message, whereas we rely on the ordinary people in our daily life? We should thing profoundly on the order of the Nature – the shining and setting of the Sun, falling of sweet but not salty water of rain, growing up of living things, Eco System of this world, inter dependence of the animal, proper distance of the Sun and the Moon from our earth, proper proportion of different gases in the atmosphere, tide in the river and in the sea, proportion of water and solid matter in the human body and on the earth and thousands of other events that has been occurred around us every day where a very little exception/disorder of all those events might bring disastrous consequences.
Roger Bacon says- if a man can not believe in God by watching very much ordinary thing such as, falling of rain and growing up of plants on the land, God will not come before that man to make him believe in God.
This universe has been created with the Big Bang. There must have been a plan before that Big Bang. Without proper pre-plan nothing can be created just with a big explosion. If so, we might have seen that a small plane or bus had been created with the crash of an airplane or with the explosion of an atom bomb it might have been created various objects. Similarly, if we put ink, paper and many other things in a printing press needed for making a complete book and then blow it up with a powerful bomb, there is no possibility to get a well-bind and well-printed book. But, the reality is that for getting a complete book in hand we will have to go through some logical process, such as, manuscript, computer compose, proof reading, correction, arranging paper, ink, printing press and many other necessary things.
Similarly, the whole Universe where billions of galaxies, Solar Systems, Stars, Planets and Satellites spreading over billions of Light Years orbiting on their axis in this gradual expanding Universe with the invisible power of gravitation in very much sharp and sensitive system. There must have been someone who is behind that sensitive and critical system. Apparently, our brain might not accept this whole truth logically; therefore, God has sent thousands of prophets as his representative in this world with the Holy Book in different ages in different regions of this world so that people can realize the existence of God perfectly.
As a scholar person you must fond of reading books of various kinds. Therefore, I am earnestly requesting you to read only the Part-II (in a single book) of a book, if you have not read that book yet, named – “Bishwa Nabi” written by Kabi Golam Mustafa where the writer has discussed on various aspects of Science, faith, religion etc. I am sure; you must find interest on those topics.
Noore Alam Siddiqui
Please find
-----Original Message-----From: Avijit Roy [mailto:charbak_bd@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 3:23 AMTo: Nur - E- Alam SiddiquiSubject: Re: Faith
Thanks.
I have read yours. As a mutual respect, I hope that you would also read mine :
http://www.mukto-mona.com/Articles/alo_hate/jaatree7.pdf
you need a acrobat reader to read.
regds
Avijit
My reply-
Reason behind the Reason
Your writing is so argumentative and informative. I thought that you were a complete disbeliever, but after reading your discussion on the issue it is being seemed to me that you are a semi believer. Sometimes your argument goes nearer to the belief of existence of God and at that very moment you come back to your previous decision that it is unprogressive, ignorance, fundamentalistic to believe in existence of God. You are so confident about the charm and glamour of being disbeliever. But the most interesting is that in many places of your writing you have given answer to this question- ‘Why we should believe in God?’
Disbelief comes from ignorance, frustration, overconfidence on thyself and over enthusiasm on a single subject. Religion does not permit anyone to do whatever he likes and consequently some people try to become disbeliever to break all kinds of moral/ethical values.
Belief is simply a realization. The existence of God can not be proved in the laboratory. It’s a process of gradual development. Materialistic attitude can not make anyone believer. We should give more emphasis on abstract thing. Love, hatred, kindness, wish, curse and so on rather than being a complete materialistic. As a rational being we should try to look for the abstract reason first behind any incident rather than materialistic reason. For example, if any one is asked why the Berlin Wall was not broken for a long time? Form a materialistic point of view the answer might be that – no people did not came with hammer, bulldozer to break it, but the reason behind the reason is that the Cold War was then ended; the balance of power was broken with the collapse of Soviet Union and so on. Similarly, the reason of crying of an injured man may be defined in two ways- from the materialistic point of view it might be that – a strong stick was put on his back and was kicked and beaten by some people, but the reality is that poverty or lack of moral values persuades him to stole something, but he has been caught red handed and is being beaten by the public. Both materialistic and abstract reasons are true, but we should find or realize the core reason behind the reason, and that should be the real wisdom. Similar cause might hide behind rainfall and the blueness of the sky, though present explanation is true. The laws of physics might be the apparent reason behind any event of this universe. Science always deals with this apparent reason and therefore, they can not give any constant theory.
There are various things which can not be formulized with the laws of physics. For example, we get various natural punishments, such as, if anyone become disobedient to his parents, if he become very rude to them, he will never get respect from his children also as we are seeing in our society. No materialistic formula, mechanism can be able to save him from getting natural punishment. But, only if he gets pardon from his parents and promises not to do such misdeed again, only then he could escape of natural punishment. Similar formula is applicable to the oppressor, autocrat, murderer and all other sinners. All those can not be defined through the laws of physics.
Indirectly, you confessed the existence of God in your writing. First, you said that if there had been any God, that might be the lifeless laws of physics. Secondly, you said that if this universe was created by God, that should be lawful, systematic and purposeful. I think, through your above comments you have confessed that any creation which is systematic, lawful and purposeful, God is behind that creation. Therefore, now it is high time to realize whether the lifeless laws of physics should be God or not and whether the creation and the laws of creation was lawful, systematic, purposeful or not. It should be realized yourself.
Scientists say that this world has been created through purposeless, lawless and chaotic situation. I should say how the scientists have been sure about that? What are the criteria of lawfulness? If we contemplate deeply, we must confess that no creation has been created purposelessly. Every creation is interdependent on each other. For upholding the eco-system and balance of environment even a very small creation, such as, and an has a great contribution to the environment. Is there any lawlessness in the nature? No scientist will be able to find any lawlessness in the nature/universe. Apparently the process of the creation of this universe might seem chaotic, but the way to lawful, purposeful and systematic universe and this is what we are seeing now.
One might think a driver of a car is very much powerful, because he can bring the car anywhere he likes, but when the car stops before a red signal, the light might seem more powerful than the previous. When a traffic police stops a car in spite of green signal, he might seem more powerful than the previous. When the owner of the car keeps it in the garage, he might seem most powerful. The observation of scientists on this universe is similar to that. They can never reach a decision on any issue.
How you have been sure that science one day will reveal the ultimate truth whereas the science is changing its decision time to time. I am also confident that science will prove the existence of God (though it has already been proved the existence of God). The existence of God is a question of ‘To Be or Not To Be’ and ‘Do or Die’. The whole truth is hiding behind our speculation. Some of us try to get answer to this question from Science and some have got answer to this question from Prophets, the representative of God. In this debate I am in a favorable position, because I follow the message of the prophets who were telling the same form the very beginning. But you follow the scientists whose ideas are based on speculation and can not reach a decision most of the time.
You are so so so much enthusiastic about science. You are severely biased with the charm of science. This is one kind of fundamentalism. But what is the real appearance and behavior of your dearest science? It has given us only the materialistic advancement. It changes its color shamelessly. It says one thing today and another tomorrow. Similarly, science once thought that all the events of this universe are controlled by the “law of causation” and “uniformity of nature” and in the root of nature there exists principle of determinacy. So this universe is like a machine and there is no necessity and possibility of existence of God. But after the discovery of cosmic radiation their ideas have been completely changed. Now they are going to Dematerialization to Materialization. Sometimes science is like those blinds who described the elephant with their own experience. So, how can we relay on science completely especially on the theoretical physics? How can we take its all theory constant and whole truth? It seemed to me by reading your discussion that the only goal of science is to prove inexistence of God by any means and the only way to be progressive, free-thinker is to support the inexistence of God. But the reality is that there are many scientists who have strong believe in God. So whom we should support in this respect?
In your writing you said many times that there are still many unanswered questions before the science. In this situation I think believing in ‘God in Gaps’ is as ignorance as not believing in the existence of God. Now you can ask me how I have been sure that God does exist. Similarly, we can also ask a disbeliever how he has been sure about the inexistence of God.
God has sent thousands of representatives in this world selecting from the whole mankind. They were given special supernatural power. They were the owner of spotless character. They have never committed any sin in their life. The First Messenger was Adam and the last was Mohammad. Four of them were sent with the Holy Book- they were Mosses with the Taurat, David with the Jabur, Jesus Christ with the Injil (Bible) and Mohammad with the Koran. From Adam to Mohammad- all of them represent the same God, conveyed the same message. That message was the existence of God, the superiority of God. Adam, Noah (Nuhu), Isaac (Ishhaq), David (Daud), Solomon (Solaiman), Abraham (Ibrahim), Mosses (Musa), Josef (Yousuf), Jesus Christ (Isha) and many more conveyed the same message and the name of that message is ISLAM. But mankind has been divided into many religions changing the message of God according to their own interpretation disobeying the command of God. No religion except ISLAM (though ISLAM is not a typical religion, it is a complete code of life) can make a believer. If you study ISLAM, Koran, Sayings and life of Mohammad and his more than 1,00,000 contemporary followers who became the all time best people of this world from the most barbarian condition. How they became the ruler of half of the world within a shortest period of time from simply a shepherd. If you study their reign up to 13th century, their social & political history, their business, their transactions and many more then you might become a believer unconsciously.
I think in spite of being a believer one can be a free-thinker, progressive, open-minded. But, unfortunately some people think that to be progressive, free-thinker, open-minded one has to be a disbeliever. If we look back to the Golden Age of Islam, we will find that there were hundreds of scientists who were advanced and devoted to scientific invention as well as to their spiritual development. Such idea was developed during the Renaissance period and reached at its pick during Victorian Era through the publication of “The Origin of Species” by Charles Darwin. In that period faith encountered the most critical situation ever in the history. But the believer did successfully overcome that situation through the revival of abstract thinking and the discovery of some scientific theories during the early 20th century. This process of development is still going on.
Not to stop questioning is the heart of science, therefore, the question-“Who created you?” can not be meaningless to science and science should try to find out the answer to this question.
Of course you have deep thirst for knowledge, but you are deeply inclined with science rather than history. All of us should learn from history. Simultaneously I would request you to study the real ISLAM, its beauty and its early social, political, cultural history. I would also request you to read some books, such as, ‘Bishwa Nabi’ by Golam Mostafa, ‘Bible, Koran and the Science’ ‘The Origin of Man’ by Dr. Morish Bukaily, ‘The Historical Role of Islam’ by M.N. Roy and many more.
Take care,
Noore Alam Siddiqui
You said Sex Education means education for making safer sex. In traditional sense, Yes. However I do not want to restrict such education in such "narrow domain". Here is an important link you may want to check, which may clarify what actually I was referring :
http://www.med.umich.edu/1libr/pa/pa_sexed_hhg.htm
Please let me know whether our children get such education and also let me know whether such education is useless at all.
"America is a free-sex country and there is a proper Sex Education, but thousands of women are rapped there each year. ..So, there should be a single Code of Conduct to make our society peaceful."
Response: Before making any conclusion, we need to know why sex harassments occur in the first place. Male chauvinistic ego, sexual superiority complex, thinking women as commodity, frustration among young generation, mental sickness and disorder, law and order situation and many other things are involved. Not all the things can be handled by proper sex education, however some can.
True, there are incidents on child molestation, rape case etc in US, however normally people do not get afraid to report against those crimes. "Raper kotha janle meyer aar biye hobe na" - such situation never arises in such countries compared to ours. Each and every country has its own problem. America is a capitalist country. Many scholars think rape molestation etc are an integral part of the capitalist system where Profits over people, viewing women just as commodities, aggression rather than compassion, and establishing control are the main tenets of the system. Of course capitalist society has some advantages which freedom loving US people enjoys; however, compared to socialist countries, women oppression, rape, molestation etc are high due to the very reason they created for themselves. The issue needs a socio-political explanation which will take time and space. we can discuss this some other time.
Statistics of rape in one particular country does not invalidate the necessity of sex-education either. I have seen one statistics where it claimed that most of the road accidents occurs due to some other reason, not due to driver's alertness or abiding rules. But does this simple statistics nullify the necessity of being alert and abiding rules while driving? Perhaps not.
Now two questions for you regarding "single code of conduct" and dress:
1) In the Victorian Era, English ladies hardly showed their flesh to strangers. They even wore gloves to hid their fingers from their view. Today, English ladies use much less fabrics than men to cover their bodies. Does this mean that the English ladies have become indecent these days? Are English men taking advantage of them? What about those women we see on beaches and around swimming pools in bikinis? Do they get harassed or raped for what they wear?
2) In the African continents, there are tribes whose women do not cover the upper part of their bodies. In the jungle of Amazon, there live some tribes whose women do not wear any cloth. Despite moving around with their tops uncovered or without any cloth on their bodies, their men do not rape their half dressed or fully naked women. This is due to the reason that "decency" carries a different meaning for those so-called "uncivilized" people. Interestingly those tribal girls use to get afraid to come our "civilized" world for being afraid of molestation. Would you kindly explain what restricts the tribal guys to molest their half-naked ladies, where you civilized guys cannot do?
Avijit
Nur - E- Alam Siddiqui
Hi,
According to you, where there is a proper Sex Education, dress is insignificant there.
Perhaps you have got the most perfect Sex Education then why don’t you keep yourself undressed publicly? Why do you make sex with your in the secret place? Why you can’t watch pornographic film with your parents/children/sister? Why you don’t talk about sex with your parents/children/sister as you talk with your close friend circle?
Sex Education means education for making safer sex. There is no need to learn Sexual Morality by Sex Education. It is learned naturally and spontaneously. In the free-sex countries or sexually liberal countries dress will naturally be insignificant. America is a free-sex country and there is a proper Sex Education, but thousands of women are rapped there each year.
So, there should be a single Code of Conduct to make our society peaceful.
Take care,
Noore Alam
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